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Batteries - Apple's take on the subject

Message #1 - Posted 2004/07/19 - zoara

http://www.apple.com/batteries/

-z-

Wierd City - where odd things happen to the order of letters. - PeterD, ucsm

Message #2 - Posted 2004/07/19 - PeterD

zoara wrote:

http://www.apple.com/batteries/

Inneresting.

They say for Powerbook batteries, they need to have their electrons stirred up, so leaving them permanently plugged in is not ideal. They should be run on battery at least once a month.

Leaving them for a long period it's best to remove the battery and store it at 50% charge.

And you can expect it to have 80% of its original charge capability after 300 charge cycles.

Pd

Message #3 - Posted 2004/07/19 - Peter Ceresole

PeterD wrote:

Inneresting.

Izznit just?

They say for Powerbook batteries, they need to have their electrons stirred up, so leaving them permanently plugged in is not ideal. They should be run on battery at least once a month.

On the other hand the limitation is the number of charge/discharge cycles. That is what gets me confused.

I'll have to try the 'once a month' trick.

Peter

Message #4 - Posted 2004/07/19 - Serge Pajak

Peter Ceresole wrote:

They say for Powerbook batteries, they need to have their electrons stirred up, so leaving them permanently plugged in is not ideal. They should be run on battery at least once a month.

On the other hand the limitation is the number of charge/discharge cycles. That is what gets me confused.

I think that letting the PowerBook charging while the battery is already full is equivalent to permanent discharge-charge: when the PowerBook is plugged-in the battery it still discharging, but it is immediatly recharging so it appears to be full. But the battery is still being drained when it is full and the computer plugged-in.

This is how I represent the way my PowerBook behaves; I can't remember where I got that from. But what's sure is that at first I let the PowerBook plugged-in as much as possible (I basically use it as a desktop, and when I move I used to plug it in), and the battery died within a few months. I now tend to avoid letting the battery charging while it is already full.

Serge Pajak

Message #5 - Posted 2004/07/19 - Peter Ceresole

Serge Pajak wrote:

I think that letting the PowerBook charging while the battery is already full is equivalent to permanent discharge-charge

Nope, I don't think so. More that it will go through very small charge and discharge cycles between the 'max' and 'start recharging' levels. As far as I can tell from the level meter, that's between 98 and 97%.

But what's sure is that at first I let the PowerBook plugged-in as much as possible (I basically use it as a desktop, and when I move I used to plug it in), and the battery died within a few months.

I use it in exactly the same way. I have done so almost continuously for two and a half years, with brief sessions on battery showing slide shows at wedding parties and while travelling. But mostly as a desk top, plugged into the mains.

Today I read the Apple piece, so I've tried discharging it in normal use, web browsing, MacSouping and mailing, and streaming Live365 continuously in the background. I slept it while I did some cleaning, and while I had supper. I got 1h 40 mins out of it before the 'low battery' warning came on at 8% remaining. After 2 1/2 years, I don't think that's too bad. I had feared much worse.

I now tend to avoid letting the battery charging while it is already full.

I shall put it back onto charge and leave it there. I'm pretty happy with the way it's performed. It seems to like the regime. --
Peter

Message #6 - Posted 2004/07/19 - Peter Ceresole

Peter Ceresole wrote:

Today I read the Apple piece, so I've tried discharging it in normal use, web browsing, MacSouping and mailing, and streaming Live365 continuously in the background. I slept it while I did some cleaning, and while I had supper. I got 1h 40 mins out of it before the 'low battery' warning came on at 8% remaining.

Just to make it clear; as I was checking, I added the times it was awake. I'm not counting the sleep time. The total time was more like 3 hours.

Peter

Message #7 - Posted 2004/07/19 - PeterD

Peter Ceresole wrote:

But what's sure is that at first I let the PowerBook plugged-in as much as possible (I basically use it as a desktop, and when I move I used to plug it in), and the battery died within a few months.

I use it in exactly the same way. I have done so almost continuously for two and a half years, with brief sessions on battery showing slide shows at wedding parties and while travelling. But mostly as a desk top, plugged into the mains.

Yeah, me too.

Today I read the Apple piece, so I've tried discharging it in normal use, web browsing, MacSouping and mailing, and streaming Live365 continuously in the background. I slept it while I did some cleaning, and while I had supper.

You are me and I claim my five pounds. Except it was Radio 4, not Live365.

I got 1h 40 mins out of it before the 'low battery' warning came on at 8% remaining. After 2 1/2 years, I don't think that's too bad. I had feared much worse.

Ah, we don't live in parallel branes after all. I pulled the power cord out at 2 o'clock, slept the TiBook for half an hour between 3 and 3:30, and it force-slept from low power just before 6, so three and a half hours. That slower processor (mine's a 400MHz) isn't such a gas guzzler.

Pd

Message #8 - Posted 2004/07/19 - Peter Ceresole

PeterD wrote:

Ah, we don't live in parallel branes after all. I pulled the power cord out at 2 o'clock, slept the TiBook for half an hour between 3 and 3:30, and it force-slept from low power just before 6, so three and a half hours. That slower processor (mine's a 400MHz) isn't such a gas guzzler.

Mine's only a 667- although the fan was on quite a bit of the time, even on battery, which is unusual, bit it's been warm today in Sarfwess London.

If I really wanted to keep it running longer, I guess the most effective thing I could do is reboot into 9.2.2, which has a facility to skip cycles and generally slow things down. I'm sure I'd be getting significantly more battery time. As it is, I'd not run OS10 on battery before, and I was surprised that it didn't slow down at all, unlike OS9. --
Peter

Message #9 - Posted 2004/07/19 - PeterD

Peter Ceresole wrote:

If I really wanted to keep it running longer, I guess the most effective thing I could do is reboot into 9.2.2, which has a facility to skip cycles and generally slow things down. I'm sure I'd be getting significantly more battery time. As it is, I'd not run OS10 on battery before, and I was surprised that it didn't slow down at all, unlike OS9.

Can't remember Jaguar, but OSX 10.3 has options for Battery Power including Highest Performance or Longest Battery Life. Longer Battery uses "Reduced Processor Performance".

I had mine on Highest Performance.

Pd

Message #10 - Posted 2004/07/20 - Peter Ceresole

PeterD wrote:

Can't remember Jaguar, but OSX 10.3 has options for Battery Power including Highest Performance or Longest Battery Life. Longer Battery uses "Reduced Processor Performance".

Jag doesn't offer that- just early shutdowns.

I had mine on Highest Performance.

Same here. But in 9 I take the skip cycles option. It does make a difference.

Peter

Message #11 - Posted 2004/07/20 - Alan Frame

Serge Pajak wrote:

[]

This is how I represent the way my PowerBook behaves; I can't remember where I got that from. But what's sure is that at first I let the PowerBook plugged-in as much as possible (I basically use it as a desktop, and when I move I used to plug it in), and the battery died within a few months. I now tend to avoid letting the battery charging while it is already full.

My experience (12" 2001 iBoko) is the opposite - the original battery gave up the ghost[0] after around 2 years of "plug in in the office, run unplugged 'till automagic shutdown at home" - that would be around ~500 full cycles.

I'll also be trying the flatten-once-a-month trick now.

rgds, Alan
[0] Well, dropped to ~45-60 mins life.

99 Ducati 748BP, 95 Ducati 600SS, 81 Guzzi Monza, 74 MV Agusta 350 "Ride to Work, Work to Ride" SI# 7.067 DoD#1930 PGP Key 0xBDED56C5

Message #12 - Posted 2004/07/20 - PeterD

Alan Frame wrote:

My experience (12" 2001 iBoko) is the opposite - the original battery gave up the ghost[0] after around 2 years of "plug in in the office, run unplugged 'till automagic shutdown at home" - that would be around ~500 full cycles.

Apple say those LiON batteries should last about 300 full cycles, so I guess your experience is consistent with that.

Pd

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