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can't restart or shut down

Message #1 - Posted 2005/07/11 - heron stone

i just upgraded from 10.3.9 to 10.4.1.

surprisingly, everything is working well now.
all my critical apps are running with no problems.

there were a few minor problems for a day or two,
but everything is resolved now... except this...

i cannot restart or shut down from the apple menu.

it looks like it's going to do it, but when it gets
down to just my desktop picture with no menubar or
doc or icons, it just hangs there.

i have to use the power button on the box to get it
going again.

it's not a big problem, because i usually leave my system running. but it still bothers me and has me wondering what's going on.

does anyone have any ideas about this?

heron

unDO email address
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Message #2 - Posted 2005/07/12 - Henry

heron stone wrote:

i just upgraded from 10.3.9 to 10.4.1.

surprisingly, everything is working well now.
all my critical apps are running with no problems.

there were a few minor problems for a day or two,
but everything is resolved now... except this...

i cannot restart or shut down from the apple menu.

it looks like it's going to do it, but when it gets
down to just my desktop picture with no menubar or
doc or icons, it just hangs there.

i have to use the power button on the box to get it
going again.

How patient have you been? In other words, how long have you waited before pushing the button?

cheers,

Henry

Message #3 - Posted 2005/07/11 - heron stone

Previously, Henry wrote:

heron stone wrote:

i just upgraded from 10.3.9 to 10.4.1.

surprisingly, everything is working well now.
all my critical apps are running with no problems.

there were a few minor problems for a day or two,
but everything is resolved now... except this...

i cannot restart or shut down from the apple menu.

it looks like it's going to do it, but when it gets
down to just my desktop picture with no menubar or
doc or icons, it just hangs there.

i have to use the power button on the box to get it
going again.

How patient have you been? In other words, how long have you waited before pushing the button?

cheers,

Henry

maybe 3 minutes

unDO email address
___
Nature, heron stone to be commanded, http://www.gendo.net must be obeyed. mailto:heronDO@gendo.net

Message #4 - Posted 2005/07/12 - Henry

heron stone wrote:

Henry wrote:

How patient have you been? In other words, how long have you waited before pushing the button?

maybe 3 minutes

Too short. Look closely -- is the little time-waster thingy spinning in the centre of the screen, about one-third up from the bottom? Go and get a cup of coffee; let it sit for 15 or 20 minutes. If it still hasn't restarted, then you may have a problem. In my experience, this delay has only happened once, each time a system update/upgrade is done. By forcing a restart with the power button, you are presumably interrupting it from what it wants to do, thus making it try again and again.

By the way -- have you repaired permissions?

cheers,

Henry

Message #5 - Posted 2005/07/12 - heron stone

How patient have you been? In other words, how long have you waited before pushing the button?

maybe 3 minutes

Too short. Look closely -- is the little time-waster thingy spinning in the centre of the screen, about one-third up from the bottom? Go and get a cup of coffee; let it sit for 15 or 20 minutes. If it still hasn't restarted, then you may have a problem. In my experience, this delay has only happened once, each time a system update/upgrade is done. By forcing a restart with the power button, you are presumably interrupting it from what it wants to do, thus making it try again and again.

By the way -- have you repaired permissions?

cheers,

Henry

thanks Henry

no spinning thingy... just desktop picture and cursor (which is movable)

yes i repaired permissions

this time i waited 1/2 hour... nothing

now what?

heron

unDO email address
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Nature, heron stone to be commanded, http://www.gendo.net must be obeyed. mailto:heronDO@gendo.net

Message #6 - Posted 2005/07/12 - Henry

heron stone wrote:

now what?

???

You've never said what kind of Mac this is. Have you tried booting from your Tiger DVD, or a previous-system DVD (or CD-ROM)? Can you shut down then?

Also -- a longshot -- you might try going into System Preferences and re-selecting the Startup disk.

cheers,

Henry

Message #7 - Posted 2005/07/12 - PeterG

On Tue, 12 Jul 2005 05:46:07 +0100, heron stone scribbled by his own authority...
(in a previous article):

i just upgraded from 10.3.9 to 10.4.1.

surprisingly, everything is working well now.
all my critical apps are running with no problems.

there were a few minor problems for a day or two,
but everything is resolved now... except this...

i cannot restart or shut down from the apple menu.

it looks like it's going to do it, but when it gets
down to just my desktop picture with no menubar or
doc or icons, it just hangs there.

i have to use the power button on the box to get it
going again.

it's not a big problem, because i usually leave my system running. but it still bothers me and has me wondering what's going on.

does anyone have any ideas about this?

heron

I had a similar problem...do a search for "Re: G4 shutdown/ restart problem"

Here follows a summation of the situation...

........................ reply separator.........................

On Wed, 15 Jun 2005 01:16:49 +0100, morenuf scribbled by his own authority...

(in a previous article):

Previously, PeterG wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 13:23:11 +0100, Kees scribbled by his own authority... (in a previous article):

Delete the folder 'Quickbackstartup' (part of 'speedtools')in the startupitems folder in the Library folder

Kees

Previously, PeterG wrote:

My G4 has recently refused to Restart or Shut Down from the Apple menu. All
the applications quit but I am left with the blue background and have to press the power button and hold down for a few seconds until it switches off.
[the volume also sets to mute when I re-boot] I can get it to sleep using the
Apple menu or the power key on the monitor. It only appears that the Restart
and Shut Down which are the problems.

I have tried...

resting the NVRAM & PRAM -battery reads 3.7v [cmd-opt-p-r] [cmd-opt-n-v]
removing and re-seating the memory
removed all unnecessary peripherals
run Applejack for Tiger
run TechTool Pro v4.0.4
run DiskWarrior v3.0.3
started up in Safe mode

I _may_ have tried other things but just now can not recall.

I am unable to say when this problem was created as my machine is normally
on
24/7 and did not come to light until I was forced to re-boot after installing
some software -and yes I have checked it. Could it be the upgrade from 10.4
to 10.4.1?

Any help/ suggestions much appreciated.

[System- macintosh G4; OSX 10.4.1; 1GHz; 896 Mb SDRAM]

Thanks I'll try that for my next restart.

You've done nearly everything already.

PMU controls boot up & power mangement issues.

At least try resetting the PMU (Power Management Unit) a button on the motherboard near the battery. Press it ONCE (too many presses may leave PMU in unhappy state and drain the motherboard battery in 1-2 days instead of 3-5 years). Restart.

If all else fails, try reseating ANYTHING that can be unplugged and reseated on the motherboard just in case some poor connection or oxidation exists. That inludes RAM, Hard drives, PCI cards, power connections, etc.

Last ditch attempt is , Archive & Install 10.4. Test if it works at 10.4 before installing 10.4.1 update again.

Good luck. Hope it works.

G'Day
Morenuf

I followed up on...

.. Delete the folder 'Quickbackstartup' (part of 'speedtools')in the

startupitems folder in the Library folder

and it seems to have done the trick.

Cheers and thanks to everyone who contributed.

........................ reply separator.........................

Regards

PeterG. (aka Lobo)

Remove MEATFREEspamblock to reply to this vegetarian.

Message #8 - Posted 2005/07/12 - Gnarlodious

How about taking a look at system.log to see what is going on?

Did you open Activity Monitor to see what apps are running that won't quit?

What about "Force Quit", does it say any apps are crashed? Cmd-opt-escape brings up the Forcequit box.

What happens if you type "sudo reboot" into Terminal?

-- Gnarlie

Message #9 - Posted 2005/07/12 - matt neuburg

heron stone wrote:

i just upgraded from 10.3.9 to 10.4.1.

surprisingly, everything is working well now.
all my critical apps are running with no problems.

there were a few minor problems for a day or two,
but everything is resolved now... except this...

i cannot restart or shut down from the apple menu.

it looks like it's going to do it, but when it gets
down to just my desktop picture with no menubar or
doc or icons, it just hangs there.

I had this exact same problem recently.

Have you done an Open Firmware reset? That's step one. Boot into Open Firmware and do the usual reset-nvram reset-all enchantment.

If that doesn't work, you may have to clean-install the system. That's what I ended up doing and it did solve the problem. m.

Message #10 - Posted 2005/07/12 -

I've had shutdown & restart problems before, but only when my iPod was plugged into its dock. As soon as the iPod was unplugged, everything was fine.

Andre

On 2005-07-12 00:46:07 -0400, heron stone said:

i just upgraded from 10.3.9 to 10.4.1.

surprisingly, everything is working well now.
all my critical apps are running with no problems.

there were a few minor problems for a day or two,
but everything is resolved now... except this...

i cannot restart or shut down from the apple menu.

it looks like it's going to do it, but when it gets
down to just my desktop picture with no menubar or doc or icons, it just hangs there.

i have to use the power button on the box to get it
going again.

it's not a big problem, because i usually leave my system running. but it still bothers me and has me wondering what's going on.

does anyone have any ideas about this?

heron

unDO email address
___
Nature, heron stone to be commanded, http://www.gendo.net must be obeyed. mailto:heronDO@gendo.net

Message #11 - Posted 2005/07/13 - heron stone

Have you done an Open Firmware reset? That's step one. Boot into Open Firmware and do the usual reset-nvram reset-all enchantment.

Could you tell me more about this please?
I'm unfamiliar with it.

heron

unDO email address
___
Nature, heron stone to be commanded, http://www.gendo.net must be obeyed. mailto:heronDO@gendo.net

Message #12 - Posted 2005/07/13 - heron stone

.. Delete the folder 'Quickbackstartup' (part of 'speedtools')in the

startupitems folder in the Library folder

hallelujah....

that did it

you have made me one very happy guy

i was dreading having to do an archive and install

now, it appears as though everything is working great in 10.4.2

thanks everyone for your help

the mac community is awesome

heron

unDO email address
___
Nature, heron stone to be commanded, http://www.gendo.net must be obeyed. mailto:heronDO@gendo.net

Message #13 - Posted 2005/07/13 - Obfus Kataa

Tue, 12 Jul 2005 (14:02 -0000 UTC) matt neuburg wrote:

heron stone wrote:

i just upgraded from 10.3.9 to 10.4.1.

surprisingly, everything is working well now.
all my critical apps are running with no problems.

there were a few minor problems for a day or two,
but everything is resolved now... except this...

i cannot restart or shut down from the apple menu.

it looks like it's going to do it, but when it gets
down to just my desktop picture with no menubar or
doc or icons, it just hangs there.

I had this exact same problem recently.

Have you done an Open Firmware reset? That's step one. Boot into Open Firmware and do the usual reset-nvram reset-all enchantment.

If that doesn't work, you may have to clean-install the system. That's what I ended up doing and it did solve the problem. m.

I have had this happen and had the reset nvram fix the problem. But something made it return. My ASL log sometimes shows that the system crashes on shutdown when launchd tries to restart syslogd after having shut everything down. Other times no kernel panic log or any record is recorded.

The nvram reset fixes the problem, in that after I use the method, login, restart (multiple times), I get clean restarts. But at some point on a system running for long periods, there appears to be a process that starts and will not shut down properly. I read that 10.4 finally implemented the system starter stop process, and I suspected privoxy on my system because its system starter is not a correctly written file. I have rewritten it to support "stop" and "restart" and will see if after a time I still get failures.

oK+++

Message #14 - Posted 2005/07/13 - matt neuburg

heron stone wrote:

Have you done an Open Firmware reset? That's step one. Boot into Open Firmware and do the usual reset-nvram reset-all enchantment.

Could you tell me more about this please?
I'm unfamiliar with it.

Restart while holding command-option-O-F and follow these instructions:

<http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=42642>

m.

Message #15 - Posted 2005/07/13 - heron stone

Previously, matt neuburg wrote:

heron stone wrote:

Have you done an Open Firmware reset? That's step one. Boot into Open Firmware and do the usual reset-nvram reset-all enchantment.

Could you tell me more about this please?
I'm unfamiliar with it.

Restart while holding command-option-O-F and follow these instructions:

<http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=42642>

m.

thanks, i'll check it out.

luckily, the problem was solved by removing the old SpeedTools startup stuff

heron

unDO email address
___
Nature, heron stone to be commanded, http://www.gendo.net must be obeyed. mailto:heronDO@gendo.net

Message #16 - Posted 2005/07/13 - heron stone

You've never said what kind of Mac this is. Have you tried booting from your Tiger DVD, or a previous-system DVD (or CD-ROM)? Can you shut down then?

Also -- a longshot -- you might try going into System Preferences and re-selecting the Startup disk.

cheers,

Henry

thanks Henry

the problem is solved now

i have a dual 1.25 G4, FW-800, 1.25GB RAM, 10.4.2

heron

unDO email address
___
Nature, heron stone to be commanded, http://www.gendo.net must be obeyed. mailto:heronDO@gendo.net

Message #17 - Posted 2005/07/13 - heron stone

Previously, Gnarlodious wrote:

How about taking a look at system.log to see what is going on?

Did you open Activity Monitor to see what apps are running that won't quit?

What about "Force Quit", does it say any apps are crashed? Cmd-opt-escape brings up the Forcequit box.

What happens if you type "sudo reboot" into Terminal?

-- Gnarlie

thanks for your input

the problem was solved by removing some old speedtools startup files

heron

unDO email address
___
Nature, heron stone to be commanded, http://www.gendo.net must be obeyed. mailto:heronDO@gendo.net

Message #18 - Posted 2005/07/14 - aRKay

Previously, heron stone wrote:

i cannot restart or shut down from the apple menu.

does anyone have any ideas about this?

heron

Yes, there is an application that will shut down your Mac. I tried it a few weeks ago from Version Tracker. It is called

Super Shut Down - 2.0b ttp://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/21250

Try it!

aRKay

Message #19 - Posted 2005/07/14 - matt neuburg

heron stone wrote:

the problem was solved by removing the old SpeedTools startup stuff

Indeed, this may have caused the problem in my case as well. I never did figure it out and ended up doing a clean install of the system. m.

Message #20 - Posted 2005/07/13 - heron stone

Previously, matt neuburg wrote:

heron stone wrote:

the problem was solved by removing the old SpeedTools startup stuff

Indeed, this may have caused the problem in my case as well. I never did figure it out and ended up doing a clean install of the system. m.

well, i got lucky this time
i was just about to do an archive and install

unDO email address
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Nature, heron stone to be commanded, http://www.gendo.net must be obeyed. mailto:heronDO@gendo.net

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